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122
all right we'll hold them roll open and
00:04
we'll go to your next bill which is SB
00:06
360 because your SB 2 to 1 is
00:09
unconsented thank you madam sure I just
00:12
wanted to reflect for one second on SB
00:14
221 being on consent it is a first for
00:17
me in this committee ever to have a bill
00:19
on consent so we just love to keep
00:22
people take a moment on that never want
00:26
to have people assume like to - the
00:31
expectations go ahead senator we'll move
00:33
to SB 360 SB 360 he asked us to pull it
00:39
from SB 360 requires clergy to report
00:49
suspected child abuse or neglect even if
00:52
they acquire the knowledge or suspicion
00:54
during a penitential communication
00:56
clergy are are already mandated child
01:00
abuse and neglect reporters in
01:02
California this bill would level the
01:04
playing field by holding them to the
01:05
same standard as the other 45 mandated
01:08
reporters listed in statute as mandated
01:11
child abuse and neglect reporters
01:12
doctors psychiatrists therapists and
01:14
others have to break client privilege
01:16
and report suspected child abuse and
01:19
neglect without exception but under
01:21
existing law clergy can lawfully ignore
01:24
suspected child abuse and neglect if
01:26
they acquire the knowledge during a
01:28
conversation that is intended to be
01:30
confidential child abuse is clearly
01:32
still a pressing issue in faith
01:34
institutions last Thursday a priest was
01:37
arrested in the Bay Area on suspicion of
01:39
30 counts of child sex abuse in 2016 and
01:43
2017 and on Friday
01:45
Pope Francis issued a decree making it
01:48
mandatory for Vatican Vatican City
01:51
officials to immediately report abuse
01:54
allegations the first of its kind in the
01:57
Catholic Church California would not be
02:00
trailblazing with this measure
02:01
Connecticut Indiana Mississippi Nebraska
02:04
New Hampshire New Jersey North Carolina
02:06
Oklahoma Rhode Island Tennessee Texas
02:08
and West Virginia
02:09
already have similar statutes they
02:12
operate under the same
02:13
Constitution and the same Bill of Rights
02:15
that we do and we have found no legal
02:18
challenges to these statutes in those
02:20
states it is time for California to put
02:23
children first
02:24
I do have witnesses madam chair thank
02:25
you Thank You senator Hill do we have
02:29
witnesses in support hi my name is
02:34
Cameron Torrez I'm an abuse survivor and
02:43
it uh it all started with my mother she
02:47
was born and raised in San Francisco
02:49
into an abusive family background and in
02:53
her early 20s she was recruited into the
02:56
Jehovah's Witnesses and at this around
02:58
the same time that she became pregnant
03:00
with me they convinced her that Satan
03:05
the devil controlled the entire world
03:08
including her family so she ran away
03:11
with me where I was born and raised in a
03:14
small town with nothing but Joe was
03:16
witnesses and you know naturally I I was
03:19
raised in a god-fearing family so I
03:22
loved her and I wanted to do what was
03:24
right in God's eyes had a really early
03:27
age around six I was taken advantage of
03:30
by a man in the congregation he was
03:32
really really close to the family so
03:34
they trusted him but my mother suspected
03:36
something was up something was wrong so
03:39
she asked me and then went to the elders
03:42
let me confirm that they told her it's
03:46
in God's hands now don't speak about it
03:49
we'll look into it and we'll do
03:51
something about it and they didn't want
03:52
us to talk about it for fear of against
03:56
Satan the devil trying to attack the one
03:57
true religion so nothing happened and a
04:02
few years later it happened again with a
04:05
different man and they said the same
04:10
thing don't speak about it it's in God's
04:12
hands and they'll take care of it so
04:14
these two men I had to grow up with
04:15
staring at as abusers and they're still
04:20
loose in their congregations to this day
04:21
with higher positions and they're
04:24
surrounded by children all the time so I
04:26
was up until about
04:27
two years ago then I realized that I had
04:29
been lied to my entire life I found out
04:33
that I grew up in a cult and that they
04:35
were hiding thousands of sex abuse cases
04:38
this this is a public safety issue for
04:41
all religions governments businesses
04:45
clergy penance and privilege has been
04:47
around for the last hundred plus years
04:49
this will cost the state less money for
04:52
having to rehabilitate people who turn
04:54
to drugs and alcohol and other uses when
04:56
they don't have an outlet has to be 360
05:01
aims to end this Clinton Virgie
05:03
privilege and have mandatory reporting
05:06
and I think it's time that the universe
05:09
is telling us to protect our children
05:12
thank you other witnesses in support you
05:20
Maddie Hyatt from the game you stay at
05:21
the table you may stay at the table go
05:26
ahead you you can speak at the mic
05:27
apologies so I was speaking to the other
05:30
witness all right yeah Maddie hired from
05:31
California Civil Liberties advocacy I
05:33
just wanted to quickly state that we
05:36
follow the no harm principle we don't
05:37
feel the state has any right to regulate
05:39
thought or belief but when people act on
05:42
those beliefs and their conduct over
05:45
steps other people's rights we feel that
05:47
the First Amendment rights of one see
05:50
swear another neighbors Fourteenth
05:52
Amendment rights begin that's the no
05:54
harm principle and that's why we support
05:56
this bill as a civil liberties issue
05:58
it's here in support okay Marisa
06:01
Gonzalez with the National Association
06:02
of Social Workers and we are in strong
06:04
support of this thank you on behalf of
06:09
my aunts Linda and Dorland I strongly
06:12
support this bill thank you my name is
06:16
Candace Conti I'm an abuse survivor and
06:19
I strongly support SB 360 I'm Kathleen
06:26
Conte I'm an abuse survivor and I
06:29
strongly endorse SB 360
06:35
my name is stuff
06:37
cars I am an abuse survivor within a
06:41
religious organization I am in strong
06:45
support of SB 360 my name is Alexandra
06:50
Topal I'm the daughter of my mother
06:52
Stephanie my stepdad Brian both abuses
06:56
sorry
06:57
both abused in the religious I'm in
07:02
support of SB 360 my name is star Paul I
07:08
am an abuse survivor inside the Joe's
07:11
witnesses I strongly support this bill
07:18
my name is Jolene Rivera I'm a child
07:21
abuse survivor sorry and I'm in strong
07:25
support of SB 3 6 my name is sister
07:31
Sophia I'm in strong support of SB 360
07:40
my name is tara james and my mother was
07:46
raised in the Jehovah Witness church and
07:50
I'm in strong support of 360 the world
07:59
needs to change guys it changes with
08:02
this Edward James stand in strong
08:07
support
08:11
Allison Hopkins Mother Abbess of Sister
08:15
of the Valley Sacramento and strong
08:17
support brother David sisters of the
08:22
valley in strong support of this bill
08:26
I'm sister Kate Mother Abbess of the
08:29
Merced sisters of Ally convent and I
08:32
have a number of sisters with us who
08:34
have suffered this and we're so glad
08:36
you're taking a nine and we're in
08:37
support of SB 360 my name is Lena
08:43
Samuelson
08:44
I'm with the sisters of the valley and
08:45
I'm in strong support
08:49
my name is Megan Griffin I am Bay sexual
08:52
abuse survivor and I'm in strong support
08:54
of this bill
08:58
good morning madam my name is David
09:03
Alvarez I'm a representative First
09:06
Nations of California Hockey Association
09:09
and I support this bill
09:13
as being 360 because I think it's a long
09:16
time coming we know as First Nation
09:19
people what it is to be abused and how
09:21
children have been abused from the very
09:24
beginning we all know not strangers so
09:27
what happened to the American Indian
09:28
people and I see it continuously
09:30
happening I'm honored that that was
09:32
asked to come down here and I was
09:35
invited to to speak in behalf of this
09:38
it's been far too long this abuse had
09:41
been going on these laws that protect
09:43
these users oh all my relations thank
09:47
you my name is James Sanchez and I'm in
09:51
strong support my name is Karen Bentley
09:57
I was raised in a religious institution
09:59
I've seen many people who have not had
10:02
their abuse reported to lawmakers it's
10:06
kept inside the congregation I've seen
10:08
it in many different religions I've been
10:11
part of the Antioch school district I've
10:13
worked with children who have been
10:15
abused by teachers I've seen it the
10:18
effects that it's had on children for
10:20
years I have friends outside of the
10:23
organization who are abused as children
10:25
that have turned to prostitution drugs
10:28
I've seen the damage that's done to
10:30
children how hard it is for them to
10:32
survive the cost it has made to society
10:37
I've seen this statistics where only 30
10:41
percent 20 percent is reported there are
10:44
many more that are not reported it's
10:45
affected Society for a long time I am
10:48
currently the secretary treasurer of
10:50
scars we started an organization to stop
10:54
child abuse advocates for reform and
10:56
safety we we thought the only way to
10:59
change society and help society would be
11:01
to change laws
11:03
and change culture the way people think
11:05
about it we want children to be happy
11:08
and free to go reported and to be
11:10
congratulated and honored in reporting
11:13
it so they will have pride and not have
11:16
to hide we want them to wrap at about
11:19
themselves we want them to move on with
11:22
their life I'm in strong support of this
11:25
bill thank you I'm Roger Bentley
11:29
vice-president of scarce and we've
11:31
chosen to be the voice of those that
11:33
don't have a voice the two-year-olds the
11:35
three-year-olds twelve years olds
11:37
they're the most vulnerable and the most
11:39
innocent and I think you can see from
11:40
this group that that voice is being
11:43
heard so scars is in strong support of
11:46
SB 360 thank you my name is Mary Hyatt I
11:51
was her sexually harassed by an elder
11:54
this is my first time speaking in public
11:56
and it's scary and I support 360 bill
12:01
thank you before I ask for the witnesses
12:07
in opposition I want to thank the
12:10
survivors very very much for speaking
12:12
and I want to just applaud your courage
12:16
it is very difficult and I think we all
12:19
know that abuse of children happens
12:24
because either the child is in a setting
12:27
where they feel they cannot tell or
12:30
their or they do tell and it's never
12:33
revealed it allows the abuse to go on so
12:36
we applaud your courage and I was I am
12:40
an abuse survivor years of abuse I did
12:45
not I was not able to speak about it
12:48
publicly until about six years ago so it
12:52
is very very difficult and I really
12:54
applaud you and now we will take the
12:56
witnesses in opposition
13:13
Navan chair and madam chair and members
13:17
of the committee good morning my name is
13:19
Kevin Snyder with Pacific Justice
13:21
Institute a Center for Public Policy
13:23
where I serve as chief counsel in my
13:27
capacity as an attorney much of my
13:30
practice is focused on advising
13:32
religious institutions in their clergy
13:35
the bill before you seeks to impose
13:38
criminal penalties of six months in jail
13:41
on a member of the clergy for refusing
13:44
to break the seal of confession private
13:47
religious counsel typically refer to as
13:49
confession is a millennia old religious
13:53
practice it is common knowledge that the
13:55
practice is the sacraments of the
13:57
Catholic Church but is also part of
14:00
religious practices of the Eastern
14:02
Orthodox Church in the Protestant
14:04
Reformed tradition it is found in the
14:06
Lutheran Episcopal in Presbyterian
14:09
churches other churches also have
14:11
confession as part of their religious
14:13
practices such as the American Baptist
14:16
Methodists latter-day saints in Church
14:18
of Scientology anecdotally in providing
14:21
legal counsel to pastors I would
14:25
estimate that half of evangelical
14:27
fundamentalist in Pentecostal churches
14:30
maintain strict confidences such that
14:33
they will not report confession of
14:35
crimes nor will they testify in court if
14:37
subpoenaed by removing the clergy
14:40
penitent privilege such requires clergy
14:43
to sail between the scylla and charybdis
14:45
they must choose between criminal
14:48
liability or spiritual peril failure to
14:52
immediately bring in the police
14:54
subjects ministers to prosecution in
14:56
jail but disclosing violates religious
14:59
practices in a sacred trust the Bill of
15:02
Rights in our Constitution is a secular
15:05
Decalogue if you will it is a list of
15:08
do's and don'ts directed at the
15:10
government passage of the bill before
15:13
you would break the first Clause of the
15:15
first commandment if you will the
15:17
religion Clause provides that no
15:19
can be passed that prohibits the free
15:22
exercise of religion placing clergy in a
15:25
position such that they will be gored by
15:27
one or the other of two horns of a
15:29
dilemma is precisely with the First
15:31
Amendment forbids just as Congress
15:34
rightly exempted clergy from the
15:36
military draft so - this body should
15:39
have the prudence
15:40
- not conscripted ministers into the
15:42
ranks of law enforcement they're well
15:44
over 40 categories of individuals that
15:47
have been placed at the service of the
15:49
state in relation to reporting
15:52
suspicions of child abuse and neglect
15:54
the church should not be used as a tool
15:56
of the state madam chairman thank you
15:58
for your deliberation on this matter and
16:00
for your service to the community and I
16:02
urge the members to vote nay
16:04
thank you do we have other witnesses in
16:06
opposition yes please proceed thank you
16:19
madam chairman my name is Andrew Rivas
16:20
and I'm the executive director of the
16:22
California Catholic Conference and I am
16:24
here to express the bishops opposition
16:26
to the bill
16:27
and offer myself as a as a person to
16:31
talk to as to why we would be opposed to
16:33
the bill and let me first start by
16:35
saying it is a self-defeating bill and
16:37
that's one of the reasons why we oppose
16:39
it any other witnesses in opposition
16:49
all right questions or comments from yes
16:52
senator Jackson yes to the attorney
16:56
who's here as I had mentioned earlier
16:59
with respect to the Second Amendment we
17:01
have no amendments that are unrestricted
17:04
and unqualified and certainly the First
17:07
Amendment in terms of freedom of
17:09
religion we do have laws prohibiting
17:12
bigamy and those are contrary to certain
17:17
certain religious groups so there is no
17:20
amendment that is without some
17:22
restriction and I'm sure you are aware
17:25
that the the fact of the matter is that
17:32
we have had a plague an epidemic of
17:39
excuses and claims of religion which
17:44
have allowed pedophiles and abusers to
17:49
exist in this country in this world
17:52
unfettered for far too long and the
17:56
notion that talking about at the service
18:00
of the state I would submit that it is
18:04
immoral and against God's will for
18:06
people to abuse children and I think it
18:09
is the responsibility of the state to do
18:12
everything it can to make sure that does
18:14
not continue I think we would be remiss
18:17
in our responsibilities to accept any
18:20
claim that religion and man-made
18:24
religion supersedes the protections that
18:27
we all children in particular in our
18:31
society so I would suggest that your
18:34
First Amendment argument is outdated as
18:39
was mentioned there are many other
18:40
states where this has taken place
18:41
without repercussion that the state the
18:46
people do have the right to limit
18:49
certain practices that are believed to
18:50
be inappropriate immoral and certainly
18:55
to give a pass because someone goes in
18:58
and confesses behavior that is offensive
19:01
to mankind and probably to God but I'll
19:04
let God make that decision I don't
19:08
pretend to know whether whether this is
19:15
something that would be acceptable but I
19:18
suspect given the notion of good and
19:21
evil and God being good and the devil
19:23
being evil that if we were going to have
19:27
that religious discussion that's where I
19:29
think we would land on God's side on the
19:31
side of good but we are a we are a
19:35
society we are governed by laws we are
19:38
governed by what we believe to be what
19:40
is morally correct and what is in the
19:43
best interests of our communities and
19:45
society
19:46
and I would submit having accepting and
19:50
condoning allowing this kind of behavior
19:53
to continue on a claim of religious
19:56
freedom I think is anathema to
19:58
everything we hold dear and I hope it is
20:00
anathema to everything at home we hold
20:03
dear so First Amendment are not
20:05
unlimited Second Amendment not unlimited
20:08
we are a society of human beings and we
20:11
try to protect ourselves and each other
20:12
as best we can so I want to thank you
20:15
for bringing this bill and I want to
20:16
thank the witnesses for coming for it
20:18
I'm sure this was not an easy thing to
20:20
do but this has got to stop and with
20:22
that I would move the bill thank you we
20:26
have a motion senator more luck
20:28
thank you madam mr. Snyder I just want
20:33
to say that we've exempted penitential
20:37
communication when it was first
20:39
addressed back in 97 but we still have
20:43
failures so what is what is your what is
20:46
your recommendation because I I
20:49
appreciate your argument but I also
20:53
appreciate what was just stated you know
20:56
we've where do we find the balance that
20:59
we stop certain activities in organized
21:02
religion
21:03
well the penitent clergy privilege is
21:08
very narrow it's when someone goes to a
21:12
minister in private for penitential
21:15
purposes and communicates and confesses
21:17
that it is not dealing with
21:20
ecclesiastical boards for example when a
21:22
priest goes before a unil of his own
21:27
denomination that that group is not
21:31
covered by the penitent clergy penance
21:33
and privilege and so and so that I
21:37
believe that there are already most
21:42
circumstances are covered by this and so
21:45
the but the and so I don't believe
21:49
broadening that into areas that are a
21:53
sacrament of the church I think that is
21:56
anathema that is a there's a
21:59
a problem in the in the notion that the
22:02
First Amendment is outdated is is this
22:04
is is a troubling a troubling statement
22:08
coming from this body well excuse me if
22:10
I'm a nobody said the First Amendment is
22:12
outdated we said it is not unlimited and
22:14
you as an attorney I am sure know that
22:17
very well so please do not miss
22:19
construed statements
22:23
thank you madam sure mr. Weaver's any
22:26
comments yeah the first comment I would
22:30
make is I was surprised by mr. Hill
22:33
senator Hills press statement listing
22:36
all the states as the former Catholic
22:40
Conference director for the state of
22:41
Texas I didn't know of any place where
22:44
any state were the penitential
22:46
communication right wasn't protected and
22:48
and speaking to the other directors I
22:51
was told that they are still protected
22:52
to this day the only state that I know
22:55
of that doesn't have the protection is
22:56
Texas it never has but it's my
23:00
understanding at least the time that I
23:02
lived in Texas the the that penitential
23:05
communications were honored and
23:08
respected the other thing I would
23:11
respond with in in terms of how the
23:13
penitential protection works is by its
23:17
very nature people are attracted to the
23:22
religious leaders their priests their
23:26
ministers their rabbis out of a feeling
23:30
of trust and in sharing their their
23:35
failures with those folks the intent is
23:39
to have a better relationship with God
23:42
if this bill were to pass and a priest
23:47
were to report something like this to
23:52
authorities I don't think anyone would
23:55
then use the penitential communication
23:57
to share their feelings any longer it
24:00
would be gone and that's it I should
24:02
also point out within the Catholic
24:04
structure even if this bill were to pass
24:08
priests would not be able to come
24:10
forward and reveal what was
24:13
in the penitential communication under
24:15
the threat under the rules of canon law
24:18
which would excommunicate the priests
24:20
automatically thank you manager thank
24:26
you other comments or questions on part
24:29
of my colleagues um I have a few I
24:38
referenced that the silence is what has
24:44
allowed children to continue to be
24:46
abused but I really should not have used
24:48
children alone it is has allowed anyone
24:53
adults children any age to continue to
24:57
be abused and we see that in powerful
25:00
institutions that unfortunately not all
25:04
but many are I don't want to say
25:07
necessarily design such but within those
25:12
powerful institutions if there are
25:14
abusers that the entities protect
25:17
themselves so we see it again and again
25:20
and again whether it was in the
25:22
entertainment industry or different
25:25
faith-based groups or Scouts
25:29
organizations or so many thinks
25:31
employers workplaces where until we have
25:36
had laws to make it safe for people
25:40
affected to report without retaliation
25:43
and without consequence
25:46
you know minimal consequence to
25:48
themselves that these the silence
25:50
continues the abuse and we see it again
25:54
and again and again in any number of
25:56
institutions and we've taken many many
25:58
actions whether it's changing workplace
26:00
rules or a whole host of other laws in
26:05
order to protect abusers and to make it
26:08
as safe as possible for them to come
26:10
forward what this bill does is put the
26:16
religious folks on the level playing
26:17
field with all other mandatory reporters
26:19
which i think is absolutely appropriate
26:21
at this time given what we know about
26:24
the prep
26:26
of abuse within these religious settings
26:29
and that for us not to would be putting
26:33
our head in the sand so I support the
26:40
bill and appreciate senator Hill that
26:43
you brought it back and unless there's
26:48
any other comments or questions and the
26:51
last thing I would say to those of you
26:54
who have spoken maybe for the first time
26:55
it does get easier to speak about it but
27:01
it never the experiences that you
27:04
experience they never go away
27:06
you don't forget but it does get easier
27:08
to speak about it and it's healing
27:10
may we have a roll call close madam
27:14
chair yes sorry I just wanted to make it
27:18
highlight a few points and thank you for
27:19
your comments and Senator Jackson thank
27:21
you for yours
27:22
and I want to thank the witnesses who
27:24
are here under great I'm sure pain today
27:28
it did not go unnoticed one or is it
27:32
unvalued by by your comments you
27:36
instantly made the comment about
27:38
head-in-the-sand
27:39
madam chair and I think one of the
27:41
witnesses and opposition stated that the
27:43
you know a person going to the church or
27:46
going into a confessional or having that
27:48
communication now won't be able to do
27:50
that but I think where the head in the
27:52
sand is is this also would apply to
27:54
clergy and clergy communication or
27:57
knowledge of so when a member of the
28:01
clergy knows that another clergy or
28:03
hears of or sees or hears something they
28:06
will have to report that in the future
28:08
and I think that's where one of the
28:09
problems is and and related to Texas
28:12
actually on the the Catholic Diocese
28:17
website it clearly states that Texas law
28:21
does not about does not respect the
28:27
confidentiality of the penitence the
28:29
penitential communications so there's
28:32
it's very clear there and it seems to be
28:33
working and as Senator Jackson so ably
28:36
comment and no freedoms are absolute
28:38
freedom of speech but you as we know you
28:40
can't yell fire in a crowded theater we
28:43
have freedom of religion and the ability
28:45
to exercise and practice that religion
28:46
but as we know polygamy
28:48
from the Church of Jesus Christ of
28:50
latter-day Saint the Saints is not legal
28:52
and just a couple of years ago in this
28:55
building we passed a mandatory
28:58
vaccination law that eliminated
29:01
exemptions religious exemptions from
29:04
your religion because the greater harm
29:06
caused by the exercise and a practice of
29:10
a religion should should be considered
29:13
and that's exactly what we're doing
29:15
today I respectfully ask your aye vote
29:17
members and thank you Thank You senator
29:19
Hill and before the roll call
29:21
apologies for indulging me committee
29:23
members but the other comment I was
29:25
going to make is that I guess it
29:28
shouldn't surprise us but one of the
29:29
things that I have been kind of
29:32
astounded at maybe astounded it's too
29:34
strong of a word but in our since our
29:37
passage of SB 1420 one which allowed for
29:41
the first time certain records around
29:43
investigations of police misconduct
29:45
certain only very specific incidents the
29:49
the the at least within covered by the
29:53
press the predominant records that ended
29:58
up being released are records related to
30:00
law enforcement subu sup their power
30:03
towards an in sexual assault and sexual
30:07
abuse circumstances and so it's just
30:10
another example of powerful institutions
30:15
that by by us not having full
30:19
transparency it can perpetuate now
30:22
certainly we know that all just all
30:25
religious people do not engage in this
30:27
level of abuse all law enforcement do
30:29
not you know it is a minority but the
30:32
more that it's covered up then the more
30:35
it can continue so senator Morlock thank
30:39
you madam chair I I want to be careful
30:46
that we resolve something
30:51
that needs to be corrected but I'm also
30:56
a little nervous as a representative
30:58
taxpayers that we find ourselves in
31:01
litigation over over this bill should
31:04
passed we had one a few years ago where
31:08
we said abortion clinics neat I mean a
31:12
pro-life or proclaims need to have a
31:14
sign and that went all the way to the
31:16
state's a US Supreme Court and lost I
31:18
want to be careful about the expenditure
31:21
of funds I'm not a lawyer but I'm I'm
31:26
just sensing that we may be stepping
31:29
into an area that is a righteous cause
31:31
but may have an expensive disappointment
31:34
after a few years so I'll I'll be laying
31:38
off on this bill today madam chair madam
31:41
chair may I respond is the chair of the
31:42
Senate Judiciary Committee very briefly
31:44
very briefly there are times when the
31:47
courts are the avenue we need to pursue
31:49
and if it's to protect the innocent
31:52
people from abuse and if it's to
31:55
challenge a practice that has so-called
32:01
protections under religious belief
32:04
exemptions I think it's probably an
32:07
appropriate place for the United States
32:09
Supreme Court ultimately to make
32:12
decisions about just the extent to which
32:14
we are going to allow the claims of
32:17
religious belief supersede the
32:21
protections of people and the public
32:24
welfare so that might be an interesting
32:26
issue should it get to the court and
32:28
perhaps appropriately so perhaps it
32:30
isn't for us to make that decision as to
32:33
whether the Constitution should be
32:35
extended as far as the First Amendment
32:38
goes to allow pedophiles to be able to
32:40
continue their pedophilia if they seek
32:43
if they seek if they seek absolution
32:47
from their church and that might be a
32:50
very interesting case I suspect the
32:52
court will come down so protecting the
32:55
public but sometimes we should be
32:58
welcoming of the opportunity for the
33:01
judiciary to exercise its
33:03
responsibilities under the Khan
33:05
and appreciate your concerns all right
33:11
we've had to close without further
33:13
discussion will have a role call motion
33:15
is due pass to appropriations Skinner I
33:18
inner I Morlock Bradford Jackson aye
33:22
Jackson aye Mitchell Mitchell aye
33:25
Morrell Weiner we will hold the roll
33:28
open until my absent members are able to
33:32
return but I greatly appreciate your
33:36
participation your testimony and Thank
33:38
You senator Hill Thank You members
33:41
colleagues all right so we will now go
33:46
to item 7 SB 2 2 for Senator Grove
34:11
pardon me
34:21
senator Grove who may
Si Lucifer fue capaz de incitar una rebelión en el cielo, eso significa celos, envidia y violencia en el cielo pese a prometerte un paraíso perfecto
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